I know it's bad. But what tier of bad is it? i.e.:

- Is it bad the way trans fats are, meaning I can basically never eat anything with it again?

- Is it bad the way high-calorie stuff is, meaning I can only eat it on "cheat days," which don't start for me for another few weeks according to the stickied thread?

- Is it not really all that bad at all, just sub-par, and I should avoid it, but if I do end up eating it that's OK?

- Is it OK, and if I wanted I could have, say, a Nutrigrain bar every day without harming myself?

I ask mainly because I'm about to go home. When I do my own shopping avoiding things isn't that difficult, but I know my family doesn't and probably won't listen to me if I tell them to. They're planning to do Weight Watchers, with products. I know for a fact that most of their food items contain high fructose corn syrup. I've read labels. But the prospect of having to buy my own loaves of bread, my own snacks, etc. is both depressing to think about and frustrating, because I know they won't like my spending the extra money.

I just don't understand how people can say that you're not supposed to cut things out of your diet, but work them into your calories, but then turn around and tell you to blanket-cut SO many things out of your diet.

the 'experts' have done a change of opinion on HFCS - saying it's no worse for you than sugar is -BUT if you can avoid it -(and it's NOT hard to avoid -if you read labels) you should.

The You on a Diet doctors say if it's not in the first 5 ingredients -then it's oK - but you really shouldn't eat anything where sugar would be in the first five ingredients. A little sugar never killed anyone -a lot of sugar -you don't need.l

I'm sorry to sound like I'm whining, but that sounds even worse.. Now I'm supposed to cut anything with any form of sugar in the first 5 ingredients? How is that not depriving myself? That still doesn't solve the problem of having to buy my own staples, since my family certainly isn't going to throw out all the stuff they already paid for.

What if I feel like eating, say, a grilled chicken sandwich on two slices of wheat bread? If I'm thinking calories, that would be an easy, healthful lunch provided I add vegetables. Now I can't have the bread unless I buy my own. I could have grilled chicken on its own, but usually, if I want a sandwich, I want the idea of a *sandwich*, not the building blocks of one.

What if my family decides to use some of the Weight Watchers products to make a dessert? (They did that a while back. It was quite good.) No way I can eat that now. Whatever they use will have sugar as one of the top 5 ingredients, and probably high fructose corn syrup. Not to mention my offending them.

Once again, apologies. The more I'm learning, the bleaker this new lifestyle is sounding. It was bad enough learning that eventually I'll have to work up to exercising so hard I feel like I want to throw up.

you're making it harder than it needs to be...

Go to the grocery store and go to the cereal aisle.

Look at a box of Cheerios - the good old fashioned float in milk cheerios not the fruity sweetened cheerios) now look at a box of Trix... read the ingredients... see where sugar falls... Which one do you think you should be eating?

My choice to avoid HFCS is based on two years of reading I've done on it and countless studies that support the decision to not eat it... but it's my choice - if you care about calories only -then that's your choice... Do what makes you and your body feel good -pay attention to how your body responds to certain chemicals and additives... I prefer to avoid anything that contains an ingredient that's not readily available elsewhere in the store... which is basically no processed foods -that's my choice... real food tastes better to me - some people - like the taste of lean cuisine - I never will consider it anythign remotely resembiling cuisine...

I don't see how I'm making it harder than it needs to be. I don't even like Trix. That's not where the problem lies.

You say not to eat anything with sugar in the first five ingredients. This means that I now have to go buy my own bread, my own peanut butter, my own crackers, my own granola bars (if I can even have them in the first place, since they all have sugar in the first five ingredients), my own salad dressing, all of this. I have to constantly pester my parents about what they use to cook dinner, and if it has anything with sugar in the first five ingredients, I can't eat dinner. I have to make my own, which will both really offend my mother, since she already hates coming home from work to cook for us, and be time-consuming. Not to mention the fact that buying my own staples costs money. Either I spend my own money, or my parents' money. If I spend my own money, I don't have a job, so I can't buy much. If I spend my parents' money, they will be angry at my buying more bread when "there's perfectly good bread in the house." How am I supposed to get around this?

Not to mention right now, where there aren't labels on most things I eat. I have no idea what the dining hall puts into their food. Neither do the people who work there. They can't answer a simple question like how their vegetables are cooked. (I know because I've asked.)

Speaking of Cheerios, I bought some. The plain kind. Sugar is the third ingredient. I guess I shouldn't have eaten them. Oh wait - I just did. Now I feel even more depressed.

I don't know what I'm supposed to eat anymore. Whatever I eat is wrong for some reason. I always thought I ate well. I don't understand. I don't need guidelines, I need hard-and-fast orders. I would be very happy if it was possible for someone omnipotent to provide me both with a menu for the rest of my life and the means to acquire said food. Because I apparently am horrible at making decisions on my own.

Or in other words, I want to know what you eat per day so I can see how much I suck by comparison.

The way I understand it, is that your body doesn't really recognize that you've eaten any calories in HFCS. You get the calories added to your diet, but you won't recognize it and won't be full from it. Look at how people drink sugared soda. Downing a 32 oz Big Gulp is not that big of a deal. Make that soda with real sugar instead, they wouldn't finish it. I've made my own root beer and people just get full from it. That never happens from soda made comercially with HFCS.

Don't stress the little things, though. There are no hard and fast orders because you are eating what other people are cooking. You have to make your decisions based on that. Therefor, you need guidelines. Otherwise we'll say, just eat oatmeal, and you'll be tempted to throw in the towel because Mom didn't buy oatmeal.

Here's another tip. Since you are not at school, and not working, help mom with the shopping and the cooking. That way you will have some input to what gets cooked.

I'm rarely full anyway. I don't think I've ever been full in years. Before I started my diet I was never hungry either, but since I'm not eating out of boredom I have that, at least. I don't even like soda.

I'm cooking some of the time, or at least she says I am, but the times when I'm not, I'm out of luck. Saying "just eat oatmeal" would help. Taking the analogy, the problem isn't that they didn't buy oatmeal. The problem is that they have an enormous container of oatmeal in the house that's stuffed to the brim with high fructose corn syrup, and she'd get very angry if I wasted money to buy more oatmeal when there's a perfectly good enormous container that hasn't been finished yet. (They don't, at least not with oatmeal, but they certainly do with other things.)

Or, in other words, this still doesn't address the problem of how I'm supposed to deal with the problem of all the staples in the house containing either high fructose corn syrup, or sugar in the first five ingredients. I don't mean to sound rude. I just genuinely don't know what to do.

Moderation...

If that is the only thing for you to eat -then you have no other choice but to eat it... Just pay attention to portion sizes...

And when it comes time to replace it - ask about getting a better choice... The entire family would benefit from eating better - even if the family is thin, doesn't make a person healthy...

That's what I was thinking - but how much is moderation?

The bread I can't replace. They buy the Weight Watchers brand, and they're on Weight Watchers (or they will be once I get back from college). I guess I could just save enough money per week to buy a loaf of bread. It probably won't be too bad. I spent that amount of money buying crap. Yogurt I probably can replace because it's sold individually and I'll just remind myself not to eat their yogurt. For peanut butter, I'll, again, just buy my own. I have an excuse - I prefer crunchy and they hate it. I've already found granola bars and crackers which, while probably higher in sugar, at least don't have corn syrup.

I still don't understand how this qualifies as not depriving myself. I keep reading that you should eat the things you like. The problem is that I don't like hamburgers, or mayonnaise, or hot dogs. I like granola bars and crackers and yogurt and cereal and all that other stuff, most of which has either corn syrup or sugar in the first five ingredients. I don't know what to do. I already know I eat too much sugar, but I don't know what else to do.

. . . now let it out! :-) Dining hall food - ugh. If it's edible, at least you aren't being driven to pizza and Krystals five nights a week.

First of all, are you talking about summer at home from school? Three months isn't that long, and if your biggest concern about the products is the HFCS, I'd say you're doing okay and not to worry about it - use the summer to plan how you'll handle fall semester. One good thing about WW products is that they can make it easy to calculate points, which I'm guessing is why your mom is relying so much upon them. Would your mom be open to input from you if you and she can plan and shop together? That program does require a fair amount of planning and maybe she will be more open to suggestions if she know she can rely on you to help prepare and calculate the points she's eating. Sticking to WW wouldn't be bad if you aren't sweating the HFCS.

HFCS is everywhere and can be hard to avoid. Rather than stress over eliminating it at first, work around the mega doses. Avoid soda, which you don't like, sweetened cereals and sweetened granola (have you looked at the Kashi products? When it comes to granola, they're not as sugar heavy as other brands and they are awesomely good) and the serious sweets and it will make a difference. Include a protein source and try to make sure your carbs are whole-grain where possible.

Changing your diet is a process - I know from repeated experience what to do, I just need the motivation to do it! You're already on your way, just don't panic. In my repeated experience, that can lead to a binge! If you are eating something that is otherwise healthy, but that contains HFCS, don't beat yourself up - just continue to enjoy it and work on gradually eliminating that ingredient as you find tasty and affordable alternatives without the HFCS. A Nutrigrain bar containing HFCS is still better for you than a bowl of Trix.

Madrone

perhaps you could take over grocery shopping and cooking for everyone? then you get to eat healthy and your mom gets a bit of a load of everyday chores taken off her back. would that work in your home?